Metal found in sump at service.

[Andy J]

Took my 2010 in for its 24k service today. Just had a call back from the dealer (Cannon Braintree) theyve had to stop the service as theyve found what they think is a spacer on the sump plug. They think its either from the clutch or gearbox. :-(
Ive only had the bike since Dec and have only put a couple of hundred miles on it. It has a full BMW history, mostly at Cannons. Ive asked if BMW will help at all as it has a full history. ( Dont hurt to ask!) Thing is, with their labour rates at ?80+vat/hr its going to get expensive very quickly. The bike seemed to run fine.
Is there a history of any particular fault? I know of the conrod issue but is there any other know fault?
Im sad.

 

[soofsayer]

If they've found a spacer then that to me would suggest there must be a nut and/or bolt somewhere in the sump swimming around also. Have they sent you a pic of it?

 

[Andy J]

No, but they did say they would if i wanted one.
But its wouldnt really change the fact that the engine is poorly.
Im gonna have to bite the bullet and get it sorted either way. But do i take it somewhere else with cheaper labour rates and hope they can fix it or leave it with them and see how they get on? Being a main dealer they will have all the specialist tools and probably the experience of working on the engines so could conceivably fix it quicker!
Its not great either way and not something i would expect on a relatively low mileage FSH engine. This my first BMW and its put me off somewhat but i will reserve judgement until its finally sorted and ive found out what its cost me!

 

[soofsayer]

I think this is one of 'those situations'. I'd let the dealer find the problem and ask them to open a case with bmw uk regarding it. Just be honest with the service manager and explain your wallet isn't bottomless. Because you have a full service history with bmw they will look favourably if it is something that is due to manufacturing defects etc.

Did you buy the bike privately or from a business?

 

[Andy J]

I got if from a small local dealer in Dec with 3 months 3000 mile warranty so thats a bummer!
They got it from the dealer its with now as they had too much stock and apparently they use this dealer to shift older higher mileage bikes for them.
Every service from new apart from one has been done by Cannon and the other was done by another BMW main dealer so the history is faultless.
As you say, it is just "one of those things" and im not blaming anyone but its not what i expected from a company with BMWs reputation for reliablity.
Im awaiting a call back from Cannon to see if BMW will help in any way but im not holding out much hope.

 

[andyf]

When in December? IIRC any defect within 6 months of sale is presumed in law to have been present at the time of sale (and therefore the vehicle was not of merchantable quality) unless the seller can prove otherwise.

 

[Andy J]

Bought on Dec 23rd and delivered to me 1 week of Jan.
Ive authorised the dealer to investigate what actually happened and i shall be contacting the dealer i bought it from tomorrow. Coincidentally they told me they got the bike from the main dealer who has it now!
Also, the service book was stamped by the dealer when i bought it do it was allegedly serviced about 250 miles ago! I only booked it in for a service as i wanted a BMW history.

 

[oldwobbler]

How likely is it the "spacer" found attached to the sump plug when they removed it was actually attached to it when it was last screwd in? What I mean is perhaps on the last service the plug was removed and placed on the floor - the spacer was close by and attached its self to it and when the plug was replaced the spacer went in with it? So the spacer is not actually from your engine. I'm guessing here as I've never taken out a sump plug! As Soof says - if there was a spacer I would expect other stuff too and I dont think it would be running ok.

 

[andyf]

Apparently it's not a complete spacer, but a piece of one (or similar)

 

[Grumpyduck]

Took my 2010 in for its 24k service today. Just had a call back from the dealer (Cannon Braintree) theyve had to stop the service as theyve found what they think is a spacer on the sump plug. They think its either from the clutch or gearbox. :-(
Ive only had the bike since Dec and have only put a couple of hundred miles on it. It has a full BMW history, mostly at Cannons. Ive asked if BMW will help at all as it has a full history. ( Dont hurt to ask!) Thing is, with their labour rates at ?80+vat/hr its going to get expensive very quickly. The bike seemed to run fine.
Is there a history of any particular fault? I know of the conrod issue but is there any other know fault?
Im sad.

You should ask those blokes on PBMagForum... they seem to know everything

:highly_amused::highly_amused::highly_amused:

GD

 

[Andy J]

So it seems GD! Would be even better if someone could actually identify it and fix it for me!

 

[soofsayer]

Apparently it's not a complete spacer, but a piece of one (or similar)

Maybe I'm missing something? Why is the picture posted by Andy f?

The spacer sizes used in the bike engine/clutch/gearbox build will be many, but not endless. It looks a fair size to me, I can't imagine how the engine has survived with that (and the rest of it?..) in the sump and not where it should be, plus what was keeping it in place to start with. Surely they can easily work out the circumference and narrow down the source?

 

[Stephen]

Maybe I'm missing something? Why is the picture posted by Andy f? The spacer sizes used in the bike engine/clutch/gearbox build will be many, but not endless. It looks a fair size to me, I can't imagine how the engine has survived with that (and the rest of it?..) in the sump and not where it should be, plus what was keeping it in place to start with. Surely they can easily work out the circumference and narrow down the source?

That sounds doable, if they worked out the size it would be fairly simple to figure out where it was from without stripping the engine. It looks like one edge of a washer, the rest of the washer is probably still in place if it was only split into two pieces.

 

[andyf]

Maybe I'm missing something? Why is the picture posted by Andy f?

The OP posted the photo in the S1000RR owners group on facebook but for some reason didn't bother to post it here. As several members on here were trying to diagnose based on a very vague description, I thought it would help if someone posted it here.

 

[soofsayer]

The OP posted the photo in the S1000RR owners group on facebook but for some reason didn't bother to post it here. As several members on here were trying to diagnose based on a very vague description, I thought it would help if someone posted it here.

Thanks, mystery solved !

 

[baz]

Actually,it looks like the locking tab off the clutch hub-it certainly makes sense!

 

[Stephen]

Actually,it looks like the locking tab off the clutch hub-it certainly makes sense!

As far as I can remember the stho doesn't have a locking tab on the clutch? (I'm assuming you mean a washer that you bend over after torquing the nut?)

 

[baz]

Yes,now I think about it,the nut and washer are all one piece and the nut is locked on its inner face.
I suppose it's still possible a piece could break off?
At least that would be the easiest cure!!
Presumably,they have removed the sump and had a look to see if there is anything else in there?!

 

[r25sti]

could it be part of this large washer in the clutch?

 

[Stephen]

could it be part of this large washer in the clutch? http://smg.photobucket.com/user/richardrmy/media/_57_zpscmxujlg3.jpg.html

That's a really big washer to fracture like in the photo... Also when you think about where it is it's unlikely that washer could make it to the sump even split into small pieces...

My guess would be it's from the gearbox.. Or possibly from the lower mount of the timing chain, I think there's a 30mm washer on either side.. But more likely gearbox as there's free play between the gears.