Main frame paint problem

[Sissymc7]

What dealer did the repair RR ?

 

[DoubleRDurham]

What dealer did the repair RR ?

Unfortunately I don't actually know. It was handled by an independent. Never having had to have anything repaired after an accident before, I didn't challenge them. Wish I had now, as if it'd gone to a BMW dealer it'd have been written off, which all round would have been a better result.

Mind, having said that, the quality of the work I've seen from main dealers in general, I don't think anyone would have been able to successfully repair it.

 

[Julestys]

The more I think about it, the more I am agreeing with rejection of the bike.
New frame will mean a major rebuild of the bike, and am sure it will never be the same bike again.
Thanks for the comments, all appreciated

Completely agree with this. The GS I had before the RR was hit by a driver at 30MPH whilst I was waiting at a roundabout on the A1M, and the rear frame was badly damaged. It was taken away and repaired, with a new frame being fitted (which took several months to get, get VIN sorted, etc) and was reassembled. Never felt the same after that, and when it went to BMW for a recall they came back with a check sheet full of all sorts of minor oil leaks and problems which hadn't been there beforehand. Only did a couple of hundred miles on the GS in the last year I had it before I sold it, as I just wasn't happy with it after the repair.

Push for a rejection/replacement, if I were you.

 

[Julestys]

Latest update is that I have taken my bike to the dealer and BMW say that the problem is caused as I have used "Muc Off".
Muc Off is not a recommended product for BMW's they tell me. Funnily enough the only cleaning products that are recommended are BMW ones!!
Credit to Benham BMW in Wolves, they have detailed my bike today and it has come up well.
However the two areas of paint that has worn through so you can see the metal underneath (identical place on either side) they say has been caused by Muc Off.
Whole bike has been cleaned with the stuff and there is no issue anywhere else, its gleaming.
Will be writing to Muc Off to let them know what BMW have said, and will also be complaining to BMW customer services.
One odd thing to note is that when I rode the bike back tonight, I could smell the cleaner they had used, as it burnt off.
Happens to be the exact same smell as the can of Muc Off degreaser I have in the garage
Apologies for the long rant, just so frustrated when the bike is only three months old

 

[pof]

Ive started to wear the paint off where my knees are to the point where im in negotiations with my carbon supplier to get some protection on there

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

 

[MacRR]

I've used Muc Off on my bike since new (18 months) with no issues at all, I would tell them to 'uck Off with that explanation..

 

[Julestys]

Understand what you mean, although my knees don't touch that part of the bike and should I be looking at carbon covers for a three month old bike?
There was a 15 plate in their showroom that did not have a mark on it.
Sent pics to muc off and lets see where we go

Ive started to wear the paint off where my knees are to the point where im in negotiations with my carbon supplier to get some protection on there

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

 

[Loupe]

Seems like a cop out to me, I'd stick to your guns as either way it's a pain for them to rectify.
Stripping and painting would be a bit of a nightmare and they probably don't want to give you a new bike either.
Trading standards are very good and gave me very good advice when I had a problem. Armed with their information I had the leverage to reject the dealers previous offers and my bike was replaced with no additional cost to me.

 

[bozzy1964]

Latest update is that I have taken my bike to the dealer and BMW say that the problem is caused as I have used "Muc Off".
Muc Off is not a recommended product for BMW's they tell me. Funnily enough the only cleaning products that are recommended are BMW ones!!
Credit to Benham BMW in Wolves, they have detailed my bike today and it has come up well.
However the two areas of paint that has worn through so you can see the metal underneath (identical place on either side) they say has been caused by Muc Off.
Whole bike has been cleaned with the stuff and there is no issue anywhere else, its gleaming.
Will be writing to Muc Off to let them know what BMW have said, and will also be complaining to BMW customer services.
One odd thing to note is that when I rode the bike back tonight, I could smell the cleaner they had used, as it burnt off.
Happens to be the exact same smell as the can of Muc Off degreaser I have in the garage
Apologies for the long rant, just so frustrated when the bike is only three months old

Didn't know you were so local to me buddy, I'm in Dudley , I'm due a service on mine and the nearest place is Benhams Wolves ... Little concerned that they are like this, and with all due respect what they are telling you is complete rubbish, the paint that is applied to a Frame is designed to withstand all weathers and hot and cold cycles of the engine, Muc off is water based so the enamel of the frame would not be affected in anyway possible ...... They are looking for a way out of an icky claim that will test their chief mechanic to the limit because as we all know, one single solitary mistake on a rebuild will cause untold crap for evermore and they know they will see you more than a stalking ex girlfriend holding your rabbits head [emoji95]


Slick mode ... It's the new legal high !!

 

[Gazzy]

Personally I think they're talking b@l@cks, if you took a BMW car in with a bodywork issue would it be due to the wrong shampoo or polish? I'd be interested to know what Muc Off say.

 

[bozzy1964]

Personally I think they're talking b@l@cks, if you took a BMW car in with a bodywork issue would it be due to the wrong shampoo or polish? I'd be interested to know what Muc Off say.

That would be so funny .... Muc off spend millions on development for some yam yam in the Black Country to say ..... "That ay now gud for yow boik [emoji2][emoji2]"


Slick mode ... It's the new legal high !!

 

[Julestys]

Thank you for your advice and I will take it to trading standards if I get no joy with them

Seems like a cop out to me, I'd stick to your guns as either way it's a pain for them to rectify.
Stripping and painting would be a bit of a nightmare and they probably don't want to give you a new bike either.
Trading standards are very good and gave me very good advice when I had a problem. Armed with their information I had the leverage to reject the dealers previous offers and my bike was replaced with no additional cost to me.

 

[Julestys]

Hi, yes just down the road from you.
The thought of a mechanic stripping the bike down, fills me with dread, as I know it will never be the same again.
Hopefully BMW and Muc Off will come back to me soon.
The sales guy I have dealt with, Dave at Benham BMW in Wolves, is a really decent bloke, and I guess can only tow the BMW line.
What I was surprised about is that I was asked to bring the bike in when the manager, Andy could get involved.
If hiding away in his office and not having the courtesy to even take ownership of the problem, or even talk to me about it, is getting involved then he does a great job.
My background is car leasing and I have been doing it for over 20 years, and I would be straight in there helping resolve the issue.
I have a feeling this is going to be a long drawn out process.

Didn't know you were so local to me buddy, I'm in Dudley , I'm due a service on mine and the nearest place is Benhams Wolves ... Little concerned that they are like this, and with all due respect what they are telling you is complete rubbish, the paint that is applied to a Frame is designed to withstand all weathers and hot and cold cycles of the engine, Muc off is water based so the enamel of the frame would not be affected in anyway possible ...... They are looking for a way out of an icky claim that will test their chief mechanic to the limit because as we all know, one single solitary mistake on a rebuild will cause untold crap for evermore and they know they will see you more than a stalking ex girlfriend holding your rabbits head [emoji95]


Slick mode ... It's the new legal high !!

 

[Loupe]

Thank you for your advice and I will take it to trading standards if I get no joy with them

Before going to trading standards write a letter to the dealer principle listing the fault/faults and why you're not happy with their "solution" as trading standards will ask you to do that.
The dealer needs a chance to rectify the problem first and I don't think they will or can do anything else to make you happy except repaint/ replace.
If you've given them a chance and put it in writing before contacting TS then they will take the case on and give you advice.
I very nearly caved when I had a problem but I had great advice/ammunition to legally get the result I wanted.
Good luck!

 

[Loupe]

Just read your post above... You already know re TS if you're in the game.
Hope you get what you want.

 

[Julestys]

Reply from BMW Customer Services:
Good afternoon Julian

Thanks for your email. I’m sorry to learn you’rehaving issues with the paintwork on the frame of your S1000RR – I canunderstand your disappointment.

I’ve spoken with Andrew Fern, head of business atBenham about this. I understand this isn’t a manufacturing defect – this issuehas been caused by using a non-approved cleaning product. Unfortunately, were unableto help.

I realise this may not be the response you’d hoped forand I’m sorry to disappoint you. But if there’s anything else I can help youwith, please get in touch.

Kind regards




Gemma

I have spoken to the sales manager at Muc-Off and they say no way is it there product caused this.


So what I said about Benham BMW in Wolves being ok, forget it.
I will be taking to the Financial Ombudsman Service and I will also advise Muc-Off what you are sayingabout their products.
Does anyone here have any good contacts in the motorcycling press? That may want to hear about this

 

[MacRR]

Can you post any pics of the damaged area up? I'd take legal advice rather than go to the press, Loupe got the issues on his first S1K sorted ok I suggest you do as he suggests.

 

[Julestys]

Loupe, thank you for your advice.
I have written to the dealer via e mail and the manager did not even show his face when I turned up.
Will do as advised.
Next step is to write to the dealer principle at Benham BMW, I have the details of who to write to at BMW Motorrad in Germany and will also be including the sales manager at Muc Off.
I think that Trading standards have been replaced by The Financial Ombudsman service, so will include them too, even though I have been told they are toothless

Before going to trading standards write a letter to the dealer principle listing the fault/faults and why you're not happy with their "solution" as trading standards will ask you to do that.
The dealer needs a chance to rectify the problem first and I don't think they will or can do anything else to make you happy except repaint/ replace.
If you've given them a chance and put it in writing before contacting TS then they will take the case on and give you advice.
I very nearly caved when I had a problem but I had great advice/ammunition to legally get the result I wanted.
Good luck!

 

[soofsayer]

You really need the dealer onside as its BMW uk that decides on warranties / replacements. the dealer will be metaphorically fighting your corner so having a good / amicable relationship is the best strategy. That is my experience.

The dealer didn't manufacture the bike and sold it to you in good faith, and ultimately will want you as a happy customer. The dealer resolving your issue via BMW uk will not cost the dealer anything so it's a win win for both of you if that is what happens.

Clearly there is a problem with the paint finish on your particular frame and I hope you get it resolved ASAP. I would reject the bike as not fit for purpose if they don't offer you a replacement.

 

[fast_ryan]

Muc-Off

I've always used Muc-Off products on my bikes and I've never had any problems to date. It's worth noting that there is a guidance on the back of their cleaning products which clearly states it is not to be used on hot surfaces, left to dry or applied in direct sunlight. One would assume that if not followed then it could cause issues with paintwork and plastics.

Having looked at the Owner's Manual (p.192) regarding cleaning it does specifically comment about motorcycle care products and what not to use. It also says not to use products that are alcohol based. Muc-Off states on the label that their cleaning product is 'alkaline based'. This is maybe why BMW have responded in such a way. If you choose to pursue the issue then your only real option to move forward is likely through Trading Standards; or at the very least to seek guidance from Citizens Advice.