BMW Track & Training Day

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BrucieB

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Had a good day out testing my new HP4 track bike....

Have any of you been on the BMW Track and Training Days?
I'm booked on Donnington 30th July and noticed they're running it the same day. I see you lose 2 sessions with classroom stuff etc. Just wondering if it would be worth doing or spend the extra ?? for a training day like motovudu which I keep saying I'll do every year.
If anyone's done it, I would appreciate any feedback.
Thanks
 
I do a lot of rider training on track and find it all depends on what you want to learn and take away. I tailor my delivery to individuals, you will be paying for generic stuff. Probably top dollar too.
Paul
 
The BMW day costs another ?175 on top of what the the track day would cost. The classroom stuff seems more geared towards novice trackdayers but they have Niall Mackensie as the star riders for the 5 sessions. Obviously it wouldn't be one on one training but still a reasonable extra cost. Was wondering if anyone has done it and had some feedback on it.
I ride in the fast group and I'm thinking about 1 on 1 instruction to brush up on the parts of my riding that I'm not strong on but think it'll be double that for a day with training on every other session.

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I did one of the James Whitham days last year and it was very good. Low number of riders, a fair few of the experts to take you round (last year JW, Hutchy etc) very relaxed and a bargain compared to most.

http://www.jameswhitham.com/
 
In my honest opinion for that money, get 1 to 1.
Rider development is priceless, when I teach, the most basic things are overlooked. When I was racing I couldn't afford the sort of assistance I do.
I got jojo 12 seconds a lap with very simple changes to her riding. Was very rewarding to see her results.

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Heard a few people recommend the James Witham days but never looked into it. Just checked and looks good, does that price include the track fee as well Soofsayer? As I know you've got to pay the trackday fee then the instructors fee on top usually but that seems all inclusive.

What sort of prices do you charge for instruction Paul?

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Please don't take any of that r touting for business, my diary is ridiculous already, especially with doing TSGB and bsb this season.
If you did wish to discuss please pm. I don't want to overtake someone else's forum question.

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No probs Paul I understand, it was my question anyway lol.
I've been considering instruction for a few years but the finances have never been there at the right time.
Think I may well try the James Witham day first of all but will look into more instruction further down the line as I really want get my ACU licence. Won't have the funds to do a full season for a bit but fancy trying the odd race.
Thanks for your advice and good luck with the racing mate

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The BMW day costs another ?175 on top of what the the track day would cost. The classroom stuff seems more geared towards novice trackdayers but they have Niall Mackensie as the star riders for the 5 sessions. Obviously it wouldn't be one on one training but still a reasonable extra cost. Was wondering if anyone has done it and had some feedback on it.
I ride in the fast group and I'm thinking about 1 on 1 instruction to brush up on the parts of my riding that I'm not strong on but think it'll be double that for a day with training on every other session.

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I did BMW track and training with Neil Hodgson at Donington last year, the plus points were that Neil's atop bloke and I/we went out in as many sessions as we wanted so lots of track time, the down side was that you receive little instruction in reality, so from a learning point of view I can't recommend it. I think you'd be better off going for something with more focussed tuition.
 
Heard a few people recommend the James Witham days but never looked into it. Just checked and looks good, does that price include the track fee as well Soofsayer? As I know you've got to pay the trackday fee then the instructors fee on top usually but that seems all inclusive.

What sort of prices do you charge for instruction Paul?

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Yes, that's all in.

The format is fairly relaxed so you can ride on your own or with one of the instructors. I had a few laps with JW on 121 and he said I was doing well. Then on the next session Hutchy disappeared past me so fast he made me look like I was on Alex's bike :).

I agree with Paul about best value for money being 121. You need to look at the JW trackdays more like a trackday with limited numbers (I hardly saw anyone on circuit around croft when I did mine which is great when you are trying stuff out) with free tuition available as required. They do some classroom stuff between some of the sessions I believe, but I didn't do any.

I think it depends what level you are at and where you are wanting to go. I am high inters, slow fast, depending on who's about etc, I'm no way up with the really quick guys but then I'm not trying to win anything yet :).
 
Re: BMW Track & Training Day

I did BMW track and training with Neil Hodgson at Donington last year, the plus points were that Neil's atop bloke and I/we went out in as many sessions as we wanted so lots of track time, the down side was that you receive little instruction in reality, so from a learning point of view I can't recommend it. I think you'd be better off going for something with more focussed tuition.

Thanks for the feedback MacRR
Probably give it a miss and maybe try and jump on Mackenzie's tail when he passes. But suppose the plus side is as you said you can go out in any sessions. I sort of blagged that at Almeria as I split my engine casing on first day and was going out testing (still had very slight leak) in every group but think the instructors were getting the hump in the novice so won't jump in that group lol
 
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Yes, that's all in.

The format is fairly relaxed so you can ride on your own or with one of the instructors. I had a few laps with JW on 121 and he said I was doing well. Then on the next session Hutchy disappeared past me so fast he made me look like I was on Alex's bike :).

I agree with Paul about best value for money being 121. You need to look at the JW trackdays more like a trackday with limited numbers (I hardly saw anyone on circuit around croft when I did mine which is great when you are trying stuff out) with free tuition available as required. They do some classroom stuff between some of the sessions I believe, but I didn't do any.

I think it depends what level you are at and where you are wanting to go. I am high inters, slow fast, depending on who's about etc, I'm no way up with the really quick guys but then I'm not trying to win anything yet :).

Thanks Soofsayer that's a great help. Sounds like the JW days are sort of like a no limits day but with star instructors to ask to follow you round and less people on track.
Sounds like a good starting point then 1 on 1 is definitely the way to go forward.
Thanks
 
I am very confident that 2 days on a track with 121 could easily get you to hold your own in a fast group. Maybe nervously initially due to the company you are in but Deffo move forwards considerably.

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I am very confident that 2 days on a track with 121 could easily get you to hold your own in a fast group. Maybe nervously initially due to the company you are in but Deffo move forwards considerably.

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I've been running comfortably in the fast group for two years now on my old gixer, funds have stopped me going for the next step forward, so I've just been having loads of fun on the tracks.
Reason I've always thought about tuition was simply to iron out my weak points.
1 to 1 definitely seems the best way forward as mentioned but it's hard doing it full on with a budget when your paying off an expensive racebike, TT trips, Spain trips and as many trackdays as possible lol
I've just missed the Bemsee ACU course but might jump on a no limits one later on in the year then maybe do one race simply for the buzz 😊😊
Bruce
 
Just reviving this Bruce, just for open feedback on how you got on from your perspective.
Don't pull any punches, I did nothing but moan at you all day :race2_smilie: its payback.. lol
 
Just reviving this Bruce, just for open feedback on how you got on from your perspective.
Don't pull any punches, I did nothing but moan at you all day :race2_smilie: its payback.. lol
I had two days tuition with Paul at Donington GP last Thursday & Friday. This was booked for months and at this time of year we expected it dry. Unfortunately it rained all day Thursday. I was terrified as the only time I had previously been out on track in the wet at Brands I crashed. Paul encouraged me to go out with loads of help and guidance. I felt like a Novice learning to ride the track again, tried to get moved down to inters but apparently a few others had asked the same. Had to get on with it and hated the first few sessions. Paul's guidance helped me build up my confidence in the wet and I ended up enjoying the day. I went from wobbling around being the slowest on track to knocking of 16secs off my original time and passing people. I'm still not great in the wet but I now have the confidence to go out, enjoy it and build on it.
Forgot to mention the rear wheel sensor failed at lunchtime and I ended up doing the afternoon with no Traction Control which isn't ideal in the wet. I was nearly calling it a day but Paul persuaded me take it easy and go back out, glad I did.
Evening time we had a de-briefing, went through videos and data etc.

Friday the track was wet but it wasn't raining. We put the R10's back on, I went out and took it easy for the first few sessions while Paul dashed off to pick up the new wheel sensor and fitted it.
We identified my weak spots and what I needed to work on in each session and I gradually improved.
The biggest hindrance to more improvement was my fitness, I'm aware I'm very unfit and barely rode the bike in the last 3 months due to various failures, I'm still getting used to the bike and building my confidence with it.
I was basically going out knowing exactly what to work on and where but the exhaustion kicked in and I forgot about half of it and just got round.
I did get more consistent times and got into doing 1.43-1.45 consistantly and beat my previous personal best by about a second. I know we would have made more progress if both days were dry but at the same time I'm glad I had the experience in the wet.
I was at Oulton for the first time with my mates the next day and although fatigue was kicking in I managed to transfer what I had learned, which helped me learn the track better and also utilise my strong points which Paul also pointed out as well. I managed to get my time down to just inside the 1.51 there so I was happy with that for my first time there.
I've now being looking through my videos and can see exactly where I can improve and know what I need to do.

I thoroughly enjoyed the tuition with Paul and I've learned so much for when I'm next on track. I would say work in progress, got to sort my fitness out first then I can fully concentrate on what I've learned and put it into action.


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Good stuff Bruce. 1:43-1:45 on the full GP circuit (including Melbourne Loop) isn't hanging around!
 
Bruce 1.43 around Donington is going some (and hell of a lot faster than me), have you done a lot of track work in the past or is just natural talent! Was this tuition you had the FE BMW thing (which I didn't think was good vfm when I did it)or something different?
 
Bruce 1.43 around Donington is going some (and hell of a lot faster than me), have you done a lot of track work in the past or is just natural talent! Was this tuition you had the FE BMW thing (which I didn't think was good vfm when I did it)or something different?
I've been doing track days for about 5 years, more regularly in the last 3. I've watched a few dvds etc and picked up the pace gradually but never had any tuition prior to this.
The tuition was with Paul M who's on this forum. He doesn't come out on track, it was all data based looking at the datalogger and my camera which is mounted to see the front suspension. He can gather more information on what I'm doing that way than someone following me on track. I've learned a lot about my riding and where I can improve, I just need to put it into practice when out on track.
 
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