front brake disc gen 3

[Handbag]

Hi after having my bike recovered due to a flat tyre it would appear I now have a slightly bent front disc brake. I'm looking for one standard Gen 3 but can purchase both if required. Would consider aftermarket discs. If anyone could recommend a good aftermarket product that would be helpful too.

 

[stuartb]

Can't go wrong with something out the Brembo range.. Serie ORO work well on my HP4

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[MoranC1]

Strange question, did you only notice after you had the tyre repaired or replaced?

I had a set of metzlers fitted and now when I'm applying front brakes I get a bit of a shudder. Only seemed to happen after I had my tyres fitted

 

[Handbag]

Thanks

 

[Handbag]

So the confusing part was, bike recovered then the tyre changed with a standard tyre and a soft compound rear remained on. I incorrectly loosened the clutch side pinch bolts but then tightened again and everything still looks in line eg ABS sensor. So when I ride the bike and pull the brake hard at around 80 mph I get a shudder through the bars, as the speed subsides the shudder lessens. I've stripped the front wheel and cleaned all the bobbins, pads etc and still get the shudder. It could be the wheel out of balance which is next thing to check then discs? Although when I spin the wheel quickly the discs look straight

 

[stuartb]

Buy a DTI with a magnetic base for 15 quid...check any runout that way, secure the base off the bike and make sure the bike is solid on a stand.. however DTI readings with floating discs can vary, but it's better than doing it simply by eye... the situation is quite odd...

Actually, what are you running on the bike OE, aftermarket ?.. what about a good clean of the bobbins...Serie ORO which I've on both bikes have an unreal amount of lateral movement..

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[Handbag]

Thanks for the advice, standard OEM. I've be told to ride with the brake on and get them nice and hot which may help. Agree with the floating disc and trying to get a good reading, really difficult. I've been offered a non OEM standard front wheel (Chinese replica) but the advice on here is nooooo....I'm going to work through it again this week end starting with the wheel balance the full disc check then take it from there

 

[stuartb]

Try see if this works.. take you two mins ..crack the caliper bolts, cable tie the brake lever against the throttle so the front is locked solid then torque up the caliper bolts.. 39nm from memory and see if that helps.

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[MrSmooth]

Strange question, did you only notice after you had the tyre repaired or replaced?

I had a set of metzlers fitted and now when I'm applying front brakes I get a bit of a shudder. Only seemed to happen after I had my tyres fitted

Always clean your brand new tyre surface with a rag sprayed with some brake cleaner to get rid of the release agent which is applied to the tyre to release it from the mould during production. The shudder is the ABS kicking in, that's why the tyre shop always advise you to ride carefully for the first 50-100 miles. When you apply the brakes, the tyre surface is losing contact with the road surface because of the release agent stuck to the surface of the tyre and the ABS kicks in - more like an annoying significant buzz in the bars than a big long shudder as if you were on gravel or poor surface.

Does the ABS shudder occur at ever increasing speeds as the agent is gradually worn off the tyre if you don't clean it? Or it stops shuddering at lower speeds the more you ride the tyre on the road?

I speak from experience of not taking my own advice with the brake cleaner after fitting a set of M7's to my Gen 3..... doohhh!

 

[stuartb]

Did I read somewhere manufacturers don't use any release compound/agent on tyres for that very reason...

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[stuartb]

Some do some don't

 

[Handbag]

A deep clean of everything I think over the weekend. I have noticed that the ABS indicator has started showing data on the dash even when the brake isn't applied that hard. Not sure if this happened before and I'm being over sensitive and have just noticed it now, it goes up in increments of 2 with 12 being the top. it kicks in and shows about 6 to 8

 

[MrSmooth]

You may well be correct Stuart, but this Bennetts the insurer article from 2018 states not all manufacturers have stopped using a release compound


The final part of manufacturing a tyre is the curing process ? a carcass containing all the component materials is typically placed into a very hot mould and cured under high pressure for about thirty minutes. To assist in the removal of a cured tyre from its mould, a small amount of release agent can be applied before the process begins. A thin residue of this remains on the surface of the tyre, leading to the warnings issued about scrubbing in new rubber.

Some manufacturers have got around this process now, and Continental for instance has developed a unique way of modifying premium tyre moulds, negating the need for any mould release agents; the finish is slightly rough and provides instant grip when the tyre?s used for the first time ? it?s called ?Traction Skin?.

A new tyre will always feel significantly different to your old, worn one, so we still recommend riding with care at first, building up speed and lean angle over time.

When I clean my newly fitted tyres - I prefer to take just the wheels to my tyre changer - there is definitely a thin soft residue on the surface which you can feel which comes off with the brake cleaner. My last set of tyres fitted in March to my Gen 3 were Bridgestone S22 and they exhibited the same residue which I cleaned off before riding. Previous to that I had M7s fitted which I didn't clean and exhibited very similar behaviour to the start of this thread.

 

[bananaman]

A deep clean of everything I think over the weekend. I have noticed that the ABS indicator has started showing data on the dash even when the brake isn't applied that hard. Not sure if this happened before and I'm being over sensitive and have just noticed it now, it goes up in increments of 2 with 12 being the top. it kicks in and shows about 6 to 8

Is that not the brake pressure indicator? As in how hard you have been braking.

 

[stuartb]

You may well be correct Stuart, but this Bennetts the insurer article from 2018 states not all manufacturers have stopped using a release compound


The final part of manufacturing a tyre is the curing process ? a carcass containing all the component materials is typically placed into a very hot mould and cured under high pressure for about thirty minutes. To assist in the removal of a cured tyre from its mould, a small amount of release agent can be applied before the process begins. A thin residue of this remains on the surface of the tyre, leading to the warnings issued about scrubbing in new rubber.

Some manufacturers have got around this process now, and Continental for instance has developed a unique way of modifying premium tyre moulds, negating the need for any mould release agents; the finish is slightly rough and provides instant grip when the tyre?s used for the first time ? it?s called ?Traction Skin?.

A new tyre will always feel significantly different to your old, worn one, so we still recommend riding with care at first, building up speed and lean angle over time.

When I clean my newly fitted tyres - I prefer to take just the wheels to my tyre changer - there is definitely a thin soft residue on the surface which you can feel which comes off with the brake cleaner. My last set of tyres fitted in March to my Gen 3 were Bridgestone S22 and they exhibited the same residue which I cleaned off before riding. Previous to that I had M7s fitted which I didn't clean and exhibited very similar behaviour to the start of this thread.

Yea, there were loads of some have some haven't comments after a quick trawl online, seems not all have abandoned it... what I also noticed were at least two firms in the far East who actually manufacture releasing agent for tyre companies lol..I would imagine more for the car/commercial market..

Anyway the vid of the German/Dutch guy with the matching suit and Iridium visor riding the brand new Gixxer out the showroom always gives me a laugh.. I need to go look for that now..

https://youtu.be/aV2iyUfGadA


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[MoranC1]

Always clean your brand new tyre surface with a rag sprayed with some brake cleaner to get rid of the release agent which is applied to the tyre to release it from the mould during production. The shudder is the ABS kicking in, that's why the tyre shop always advise you to ride carefully for the first 50-100 miles. When you apply the brakes, the tyre surface is losing contact with the road surface because of the release agent stuck to the surface of the tyre and the ABS kicks in - more like an annoying significant buzz in the bars than a big long shudder as if you were on gravel or poor surface.

Does the ABS shudder occur at ever increasing speeds as the agent is gradually worn off the tyre if you don't clean it? Or it stops shuddering at lower speeds the more you ride the tyre on the road?

I speak from experience of not taking my own advice with the brake cleaner after fitting a set of M7's to my Gen 3..... doohhh!

It's not abs, feels more like disc warp

 

[alex]

Replace the discs, worst that can happen is you end up with good spares, they are a consumable.

- Alex