My RoSPA Journey with EAMG
- Thread starter Oli
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Only one casualty ! Sounds like that was lucky? Was just thinking about more riders leading rideouts, riding with unknowns and your take on it.
Sorry Oli, a little off topic.
Oli
Well-known member
Nae bother [emoji6]
Oli
Well-known member
The man maths sounds about right to me lol.
That would make for an entertaining combination, a vowel heavy Scottish accent with lots of arm waving!
Oli
Well-known member
Update 2.
@preynol1 and I ventured out for my second Observed ride today, and what a fantastic day it has been, despite the adverse weather, really enjoyed it!
We rode a round trip starting at the Boreham McD?s and ending up at Southend.
The gusting winds did not pose an issue. However the roads were ?extremely? slippery in places as a result of the over-banding.
I enjoy riding year round as like the challenge of riding in ?almost? all of the road conditions Mother Nature throws at us. Perhaps this is just me but in an extremely childish way I also enjoy testing out how waterproof my kit is lol [emoji23]
Anyway, back to the actual RoadCraft assessment and lesson.
I felt more relaxed under observation this time then previously, the thing I find most challenging/requires most concentration is checking my mirrors sufficiently to know where I should go. To this end, after failing to pair our Bluetooth intercoms at McD?s, we ventured back to Paul?s to collect some radios (like you use on a riding test). It was a pleasure meeting Paul?s family prior to heading off for the observed part of the day. Hopefully I didn?t bore them to much blabbering on about proteins lol.
We rode a variety of road types today, from poor road quality country lanes, 30?s, 40?s and 50?s in residential and town areas, to some brief stints on duel carriageways.
Without going into all the details, some of the positives were that Paul and I felt that my use of the gears had improved since my first observed ride, such that with the throttle in ?Race mode?, with some engine breaking on tap, I was able to navigate the country lanes without having to use the brakes. I was pleased with this as in order to do it you need to successfully read the road and judge corners correctly. Reading the vantage point is something I?ve been trying to practice for a while now and I feel it is becoming more instinctive and thus I am better able to put it into practice.
Another area of improvement is general road positioning in the country lanes, though there is still some room for improvement here.
Some areas that still need work are my pre-overtaking positioning. This has improved, but I still need to experiment holding back further and playing about with road position in order to maximise my vision down the road.
Another thing I need to work on is road positioning in 30?s and 40?s, as I have a tendency to treat them like national zones position wise, which in these areas is not always appropriate.
Another main area I will focus on before our next ride is roundabouts. I need to start slowing down slightly earlier in order to better read the road signage so that I know what lane to be in and what exit to take.
Towards the end of the day, Paul told me I could ?have some fun in the Nationals if I wanted? ... errr, yes sir! [emoji6]
The roads were just starting to dry out and it was great fun carrying some speed along good roads. I was pleased that despite the pace being upped, I was still sticking to the system. This is particularly important to me as a couple times in the past I?ve felt myself over-ride and no longer read the road for myself.
Overall though I am very glad to know that my riding is heading in the right direction, and as I say it was a throughly enjoyable day.
It truly is surprising how much fun you can have sticking to national speed limits religiously when you?re under observation in tricky conditions!
Hope you?ve all had a great weekend.
Ride safe and have fun,
- Oli
@preynol1 and I ventured out for my second Observed ride today, and what a fantastic day it has been, despite the adverse weather, really enjoyed it!
We rode a round trip starting at the Boreham McD?s and ending up at Southend.
The gusting winds did not pose an issue. However the roads were ?extremely? slippery in places as a result of the over-banding.
I enjoy riding year round as like the challenge of riding in ?almost? all of the road conditions Mother Nature throws at us. Perhaps this is just me but in an extremely childish way I also enjoy testing out how waterproof my kit is lol [emoji23]
Anyway, back to the actual RoadCraft assessment and lesson.
I felt more relaxed under observation this time then previously, the thing I find most challenging/requires most concentration is checking my mirrors sufficiently to know where I should go. To this end, after failing to pair our Bluetooth intercoms at McD?s, we ventured back to Paul?s to collect some radios (like you use on a riding test). It was a pleasure meeting Paul?s family prior to heading off for the observed part of the day. Hopefully I didn?t bore them to much blabbering on about proteins lol.
We rode a variety of road types today, from poor road quality country lanes, 30?s, 40?s and 50?s in residential and town areas, to some brief stints on duel carriageways.
Without going into all the details, some of the positives were that Paul and I felt that my use of the gears had improved since my first observed ride, such that with the throttle in ?Race mode?, with some engine breaking on tap, I was able to navigate the country lanes without having to use the brakes. I was pleased with this as in order to do it you need to successfully read the road and judge corners correctly. Reading the vantage point is something I?ve been trying to practice for a while now and I feel it is becoming more instinctive and thus I am better able to put it into practice.
Another area of improvement is general road positioning in the country lanes, though there is still some room for improvement here.
Some areas that still need work are my pre-overtaking positioning. This has improved, but I still need to experiment holding back further and playing about with road position in order to maximise my vision down the road.
Another thing I need to work on is road positioning in 30?s and 40?s, as I have a tendency to treat them like national zones position wise, which in these areas is not always appropriate.
Another main area I will focus on before our next ride is roundabouts. I need to start slowing down slightly earlier in order to better read the road signage so that I know what lane to be in and what exit to take.
Towards the end of the day, Paul told me I could ?have some fun in the Nationals if I wanted? ... errr, yes sir! [emoji6]
The roads were just starting to dry out and it was great fun carrying some speed along good roads. I was pleased that despite the pace being upped, I was still sticking to the system. This is particularly important to me as a couple times in the past I?ve felt myself over-ride and no longer read the road for myself.
Overall though I am very glad to know that my riding is heading in the right direction, and as I say it was a throughly enjoyable day.
It truly is surprising how much fun you can have sticking to national speed limits religiously when you?re under observation in tricky conditions!
Hope you?ve all had a great weekend.
Ride safe and have fun,
- Oli
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Interesting stuff Oli - thanks for the update.
I really need to look into this.
I really need to look into this.
With any training there will always be something you learn no matter how small it seems, and maybe confirmation you were as good as thought you are.
With a local Advanced group the courses are less cost, tailored to your needs / wants, one to one and generally there is a wealth of resource and advice available.
For the sake of ?10 and cup of tea per ride can?t be bad.
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What, you dont get Cake ? Oli, sort it.
Oli
Well-known member
So I really shouldn?t say I forgot the tenner last week then lol!
I?m still trying to buy Paul lunch but he?s not partaking in the activity, actually felt rather bad wafting down a post ride McD?s after the first observed ride!
- Oli
Oli
Well-known member
Went for an observed ride with @phil last Saturday 11th and had another great day.
The day got off to a good start as within no time at all we managed to pair out intercoms, despite Phil?s being a Cardo unit and mine a Sena. I was properly chuffed as felt like I was in a Revzilla video lol [emoji41]
As for the ride, I have no idea where we went as I forgot to track the route and have pretty much zero innate sense of navigation. All I know is it went up and down left and right and at one point the sea was on the right hand side lol.
Not sure why but for some reason I just didn?t feel I was riding my best, didn?t feel stressed or anything, even had a good nights sleep too. I guess it?s inevitable to have better/worse days periodically when learning new things.
To my surprise Phil thought my riding was coming along well and didn?t sense my inner riding turmoil lol, which was great to hear.
As per my riding with @preynol1, we strictly adhered to all posted speed limits, including nationals. I prefer this, for learning, as means you have that bit more time to think about things and it helps train the brain to accelerate to, but not past, the speed limit when entering a national zone or when overtaking.
Since starting the training, I find I am using a gear or two lower than I previously would. I now use 2nd for 30?s, 3rd for 40?s and usually 4th in 60?s (unless it?s a straight line). With the engine in Race mode I find it easier to stick to the posted speed limits and to control your speed with the throttle due to the increased engine breaking vs Slick.
We ended up at Finchingfield, had an ice cream and de-brief.
Phil was happy with my road positioning, in both Nationals and 30?s/40?s. We didn?t spend much time on duel carriageways, but I know I need to focus on this from my previous ride with Paul.
I still need to work on my forward planning and pre-overtake preparation.
I also need to ease up on the corner entry speed a tad, this is also something Paul mentioned I need to be mindful of in the dry (it?s just too easy to have fun with these bikes [emoji6]).
One of the areas I felt I improved on during the ride was acceleration sense. This is basically how much bean you give it when accelerating, I actually ended up accelerating more assertively than previously (when under observation).
Towards the end of the ride I did one less then ideal overtake, which I was frustrated with as felt I had made some progress with my overtaking. It wasn?t dangerous, but it wasn?t sexy. We were following two vehicles, a car and a van travelling slowly in a national zone. As we got round the bend I saw that the road was straight so moved out and saw there was no junctions so overtook the first car. The problem was that the van in front was travelling slowly due to a couple cyclists, which means that the van and car are both going to want to overtake. Although I paused and saw that the van was not immediately pulling out to overtake (one assumes they checked the mirrors and saw me), it was poor judgment on my part as would have been far better to have waited for the two vehicles to overtake and then proceed to overtake them both when safe to do so.
It?s all a balancing act really, between restraint and assertion, one which I am still struggling with periodically. I find it particularly so when being stuck behind traffic and not finding an opportunity to overtake, it?s as if the pressure begins to build and I feel as though I second guess whether I am missing overtaking opportunities. Thankfully for the most part Phil assured me I wasn?t, with the exception of one place where proficient forward planning would have allowed for an overtake, yet I held back. Until next time as they say! [emoji4]
As I say I had another really enjoyable and beneficial day, and I am looking forward to my next observed ride. Will keep practicing and hopefully next time I ride with Paul I?ll have made some more progress.
Hope everyone?s weeks have got off to a good start?
Ride safe and have fun,
- Oli
The day got off to a good start as within no time at all we managed to pair out intercoms, despite Phil?s being a Cardo unit and mine a Sena. I was properly chuffed as felt like I was in a Revzilla video lol [emoji41]
As for the ride, I have no idea where we went as I forgot to track the route and have pretty much zero innate sense of navigation. All I know is it went up and down left and right and at one point the sea was on the right hand side lol.
Not sure why but for some reason I just didn?t feel I was riding my best, didn?t feel stressed or anything, even had a good nights sleep too. I guess it?s inevitable to have better/worse days periodically when learning new things.
To my surprise Phil thought my riding was coming along well and didn?t sense my inner riding turmoil lol, which was great to hear.
As per my riding with @preynol1, we strictly adhered to all posted speed limits, including nationals. I prefer this, for learning, as means you have that bit more time to think about things and it helps train the brain to accelerate to, but not past, the speed limit when entering a national zone or when overtaking.
Since starting the training, I find I am using a gear or two lower than I previously would. I now use 2nd for 30?s, 3rd for 40?s and usually 4th in 60?s (unless it?s a straight line). With the engine in Race mode I find it easier to stick to the posted speed limits and to control your speed with the throttle due to the increased engine breaking vs Slick.
We ended up at Finchingfield, had an ice cream and de-brief.
Phil was happy with my road positioning, in both Nationals and 30?s/40?s. We didn?t spend much time on duel carriageways, but I know I need to focus on this from my previous ride with Paul.
I still need to work on my forward planning and pre-overtake preparation.
I also need to ease up on the corner entry speed a tad, this is also something Paul mentioned I need to be mindful of in the dry (it?s just too easy to have fun with these bikes [emoji6]).
One of the areas I felt I improved on during the ride was acceleration sense. This is basically how much bean you give it when accelerating, I actually ended up accelerating more assertively than previously (when under observation).
Towards the end of the ride I did one less then ideal overtake, which I was frustrated with as felt I had made some progress with my overtaking. It wasn?t dangerous, but it wasn?t sexy. We were following two vehicles, a car and a van travelling slowly in a national zone. As we got round the bend I saw that the road was straight so moved out and saw there was no junctions so overtook the first car. The problem was that the van in front was travelling slowly due to a couple cyclists, which means that the van and car are both going to want to overtake. Although I paused and saw that the van was not immediately pulling out to overtake (one assumes they checked the mirrors and saw me), it was poor judgment on my part as would have been far better to have waited for the two vehicles to overtake and then proceed to overtake them both when safe to do so.
It?s all a balancing act really, between restraint and assertion, one which I am still struggling with periodically. I find it particularly so when being stuck behind traffic and not finding an opportunity to overtake, it?s as if the pressure begins to build and I feel as though I second guess whether I am missing overtaking opportunities. Thankfully for the most part Phil assured me I wasn?t, with the exception of one place where proficient forward planning would have allowed for an overtake, yet I held back. Until next time as they say! [emoji4]
As I say I had another really enjoyable and beneficial day, and I am looking forward to my next observed ride. Will keep practicing and hopefully next time I ride with Paul I?ll have made some more progress.
Hope everyone?s weeks have got off to a good start?
Ride safe and have fun,
- Oli
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JimmyMac
Well-known member
Wow, is that all it takes Oli, an ice-cream, you are too cheap darling, lol.
Your perceived improvement will often be smaller than your actual progress as we are all super critical when trying to improve, your reactions will become second nature and you don't even acknowledge when you are doing things right.
Don't worry about the van and bikes, as long as it wasn't dangerous and all parties were ok then its 'winner winner chicken dinner'. I almost wiped out a civilian XR2 when was doing my advanced Police driving and my instructor merely asked me to avoid Sierras as his wife had one.
You are clearly an analytical type of person Oli and you remind me of an attentive young puppy eager to learn. Great quality to try to be the best you can at whatever you are doing.
Keep enjoying the lessons and as Baz said "Be careful whose advice you buy, but be patient with those that supply it."
JimmyMac
Sounds like you are doing fine oli, just keep practicing and the methodology becomes second nature, eventually you will ‘just’ ride that way, and be quicker and safer for it.
I was reading in TG magazine yesterday the idea of getting car drivers to learn to ride a motorbike and take a test to improve their observational skills. Obviously that is never going to happen, but similarly I think the bike advanced training should be part of the normal test. Both would save lives.
Anyway, enough of my mutterings, keep up the good work!
I was reading in TG magazine yesterday the idea of getting car drivers to learn to ride a motorbike and take a test to improve their observational skills. Obviously that is never going to happen, but similarly I think the bike advanced training should be part of the normal test. Both would save lives.
Anyway, enough of my mutterings, keep up the good work!
Oli
Well-known member
Lol I?m too innocent to have understood that first bit [emoji23]
Thank you for the support/reassurance Jimmy, you?re right we are our own harshest critic.
Made me laugh that story of you during the Advanced training, can picture you with your multi-coloured sunglasses and the blues and twos on followed by ?nae botha Captain? [emoji12]
Haha ahh thanks Jimmy, I?ll make you laugh, for some reason when I first read your reply I thought you said I remind you of ?an attractive young puppy?, I actually checked myself out in the mirror and thought hmm perhaps lol [emoji23] ... then re-read ?attentive? and thought, well that?s still good, I mean the ladies are sure to love the attentive analytical guy lol! [emoji23]
Seriously though thank you again for the kind words [emoji846] I blame the PhD for the analytical disposition, it can be a good thing, but can also hinder progress when ?over?analysing things.
Good quote!
Thanks Andy, the general road positioning is definitely feeling more natural now and I don?t feel I have to consciously think about it as such. Next goal is to make overtaking more effortless so as to keep making progress.
Being quicker and safer is the name of the game after all [emoji41]
Fully agree, I think elements of RoadCraft should be integrated into the Mod2 motorcycle test, would be far better to instil good road position and hazard awareness practices in people right at the start of the automotive journey.
Will do and I look forward to updating the thread again in due course!
- Oli
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Oli, your comments show your thinking differently to the way you were about your riding. By recognising when and how things could have been better is a sign of the right attitude.
It?s when you stop thinking that could have gone better or don?t learn from a mistake that you might as well give up.
It?s also good to hear that Phil and I are making the same observations shows the level your already at.
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It?s when you stop thinking that could have gone better or don?t learn from a mistake that you might as well give up.
It?s also good to hear that Phil and I are making the same observations shows the level your already at.
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Oli
Well-known member
Since the last instalment I?ve been on two more observed rides with @preynol1, today being the 4th.
Had another throughly enjoyable day on the bike, with many laughs along the way and a near drowning when I cracked up precisely at the moment I was having a sip of tea, I have only just recovered lol ...
I was really pleased with the progress made today, I felt as though the pre-overtake positioning started to click and so the few overtaking opportunities that arose felt ?progressive? [emoji41]
We had a short stint on a duel carriageway which I felt went better than previously as moved lanes earlier and used the same road positioning as in 30?s and 40?s.
I still need to control my exuberance with regards to corner entry speed, as have a tendency to get a little too sporting for test conditions. It?s bloody difficult though when we?re onboard such awesome machines, every time I go for a ride on my RR I am genuinely blown away by how utterly exciting and impressive these bikes are!
I also need to work on forward planning a bit, such as slowing up ahead of congestion etc, as this allows you to mange your space more effectively and be less reliant on the brakes in 30?s.
So basically, riding God, or as Paul says ?the over-confidence stage? lol [emoji23]
- Oli
Had another throughly enjoyable day on the bike, with many laughs along the way and a near drowning when I cracked up precisely at the moment I was having a sip of tea, I have only just recovered lol ...
I was really pleased with the progress made today, I felt as though the pre-overtake positioning started to click and so the few overtaking opportunities that arose felt ?progressive? [emoji41]
We had a short stint on a duel carriageway which I felt went better than previously as moved lanes earlier and used the same road positioning as in 30?s and 40?s.
I still need to control my exuberance with regards to corner entry speed, as have a tendency to get a little too sporting for test conditions. It?s bloody difficult though when we?re onboard such awesome machines, every time I go for a ride on my RR I am genuinely blown away by how utterly exciting and impressive these bikes are!
I also need to work on forward planning a bit, such as slowing up ahead of congestion etc, as this allows you to mange your space more effectively and be less reliant on the brakes in 30?s.
So basically, riding God, or as Paul says ?the over-confidence stage? lol [emoji23]
- Oli
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GixxerChuck
Forum Vendor
Advanced riding is well worth doing and in my opinion you can?t have too much training or refreshers. I did my IAM advanced and followed this with my IAM masters. Advanced is being in the right place most of the time, riding to the system and making progress. Masters is being able to do it all of the time on an extended 1hr plus ride with someone right up your chuff and then being able to justify every action asked about.
Despite having these I am off to do a day with Rapid Training in a couple of weeks just to brush up.
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Despite having these I am off to do a day with Rapid Training in a couple of weeks just to brush up.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Good to read that it is all coming together Oli and thanks for keeping us updated on your progress.
Oli
Well-known member
Well, today was test day!
Passed with a RoSPA Silver grade, which I am pleased with. Have Gold to aim for in future [emoji846]
A massive thank you to my observer @preynol1 and @phil for teaching me Roadcraft and helping me with my riding. It has been a fantastic experience [emoji4]
Irrespective of the testing, ?I? have seen a massive improvement in my riding, and having critical friends whose opinion and judgement you respect to say that your riding well, is for me the best part of the process.
There is no real financial incentive to perusing advanced training. However, if you ride a motorcycle on the road and you have an open mind, it will make you a better rider ...
- Oli
Passed with a RoSPA Silver grade, which I am pleased with. Have Gold to aim for in future [emoji846]
A massive thank you to my observer @preynol1 and @phil for teaching me Roadcraft and helping me with my riding. It has been a fantastic experience [emoji4]
Irrespective of the testing, ?I? have seen a massive improvement in my riding, and having critical friends whose opinion and judgement you respect to say that your riding well, is for me the best part of the process.
There is no real financial incentive to perusing advanced training. However, if you ride a motorcycle on the road and you have an open mind, it will make you a better rider ...
- Oli
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